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Post by robeiae on Jul 17, 2019 8:21:19 GMT -5
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Post by nighttimer on Jul 17, 2019 9:36:51 GMT -5
Using Twitter to publicly "clap back" (God, that phrase is stupid) at others is not something that adults do; it's something that 12-year-old brats do. This kind of juvenile shit never helps us, only hurts our chances in 2020 and beyond. I don't think they're just damaging our chances in the next election; they might be damaging the Democrat "brand" for years to come. You say that as if it's a bad thing. Maybe the Democrat "brand" needs to be damaged and discarded as nothing more than a corrupted pc that has been bricked. It can't be rebooted. It can't be repaired. It's nothing but a large paperweight. So you junk it and replace it with something newer and faster and more reliable and better.
There is nothing sacred about the Democratic Party. Political parties are vehicles, not destinations, and any political party that can't handle the natural tensions, disputes and squabbles between different wings of the party without totally imploding deserves to die off. The Democrat brand was jacked up long before AOC showed up.
It is not "juvenile shit" for AOC and the three other members of The Squad to utilize social media to their maximum advantage. Why not? It's not as though the Racist-In-Chief hasn't done the exact same thing and worse in weaponizing Twitter to further his own "juvenile shit" but you won't see Republicans calling him out the way Democrats are doing with their own.
And I'm here for it. Phrases such as "...never helps US...," "...only hurts OUR chances..." and "...damaging OUR chances..." is Chicken Little hand-wringing. Consensus is only achieved through conflict, not the absence of it and if you want mindless conformity and marching in lockstep even when it leads over a cliff, maybe you should consider switching over to the GOP? Apparently, they're kind of big in that sort of gagging dissenting voices and then publicly executing them to send an example to anyone else who might consider deviating from the party line.
There is no "us." There is no "our." There's what one side wants and what the other side wants and how they find a middle ground to get some of what both want. We don't have to like each other to work with each other and when that's done, each side can fuck back off to their respective corners. Cognitive dissonance can be uncomfortable for those experiencing it, but since it is possible for two things to both be true, it works out better to work out differences instead of insisting on everyone agreeing that they are all wrong and only your side is right.
Nancy Pelosi is a smart politician, but at 79 years old, she's not the future of the Democratic Party. I don't care if that sounds ageist. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Ayanna Pressley, Rashida Talib, Ilhan Omar and progressives like them as well as moderates and more traditional mainstream are among the next generation of liberal leadership. The old guard has to make way for the young guns and if they won't leave the stage voluntarily, then they will have to be pushed off it physically.
Should Joe Biden emerge from the fray as the Democratic challenger against Trump, he's got my vote. A diseased tree stump would get my vote over Trump, but anybody who thinks for one second those voters who supported the members of The Squad aren't taking names of the party members who are trying to silence all dissenting voices is kidding themselves. Names are being taken and paybacks will be served.
And if "clap back" is stupid, what is "ouroboros" if not pretentiously stupid? The majority of human beings on this mudball will go their entire lives and never use "ouroboros" in a sentence. Usage of a five-dollar-word when a one-dollar word will do fine isn't an indication of a high degree of intelligence. It's just showing off like a child who dances around squealing, "I know big words!"
However, your proclivity for sesquipedalian loquaciousness is duly noted.
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Post by Optimus on Jul 17, 2019 10:37:50 GMT -5
And if "clap back" is stupid, what is "ouroboros" if not pretentiously stupid? The majority of human beings on this mudball will go their entire lives and never use "ouroboros" in a sentence. Usage of a five-dollar-word when a one-dollar word will do fine isn't an indication of a high degree of intelligence. It's just showing off like a child who dances around squealing, "I know big words!"
However, your proclivity for sesquipedalian loquaciousness is duly noted. Adversarial
If people are genuinely interested in changing minds, arguments need to be less adversarial. “There is a whole body of literature in psychology about persuasion, influence and attitude change,” Suler says. “For example, how do you convince someone to believe something? Those principles apply as much to online behaviour as they do to offline behaviour. ‘Joining and leading’ is one strategy: you join the other person’s point of view on some particular point in the argument, then slowly lead them from that point to something new you want them to believe.” This kind of idiotic hypocrisy is why no one ever has and ever will take you seriously.
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Post by nighttimer on Jul 17, 2019 11:33:57 GMT -5
This kind of idiotic hypocrisy is why no one ever has and ever will take you seriously. I can't say I give a fuck about being taken seriously by someone who calls himself a "liberal" but cuddles up to racist White fucks like Milo Yiannopoulos, Charles Murray and James Damore while talking shit about women of color like Kamala Harris and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.
I'm taken very seriously by serious people like the ones who responded to me directly.
You think you're playing me as a hypocrite by referencing a post that invited you personally to try and engage in a mutually beneficial attempt at civility? An attempt you ignored until such time as you believed you could attempt to embarrass me by throwing the quote back in my face to say, "See! I told you he didn't mean any of it!"
Stupidly I made a gesture to treat you decently, but obviously you have no clue on how to respond to that sort of thing besides shitting all over it. My bad. Won't happen again. You can bet your sorry and petty ass on that.
I will give you half-credit though. This time you were man enough to come at me yourself instead of hiding behind someone else's skirt. This is the sort of dickhead behavior you've been engaged in for years now. At least you're consistent. Consistently weak.
You truly are an even bigger asshole than I thought you were.
By the way, that Axios poll on how AOC is absolute poison for the Dems both you and Trump are talking out of your asses about---yeah, it's kinda bullshit. Which explains why you posted it.
Huffington Post:
Axios can flat fuck off with their dumb-ass anonymous polls being pushed by alt-right trolls and left-wing useful idiots, so stick to your right-wing fake news websites, Opty. They are pitched at such a low-enough intellectual level that even you should have no problem reaching.
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Post by nighttimer on Jul 17, 2019 14:45:10 GMT -5
Did Nancy Pelosi beat an incumbent Democrat to win her seat? AOC and Ayanna Pressley did including the 4th highest-ranking Democrat in the House. You think that endeared AOC to Pelosi?
Why did Pelosi include Ocasio-Cortez and Ilhan Omar in her Rolling Stone cover shoot? Why does the first woman to ever be Speaker of the House have to share a magazine cover with two members of the notorious Squad?
Maybe because if Pelosi wants to piss off the progressives and people of color she will need if she hopes to hold onto the gavel she can't just sit around with her shit-stirring boo Maureen Dowd bitching and griping about four fresh faces in that mausoleum see runs. Democrats can't win the presidency, the Senate or hold on to the House if they think all they have to do is to appeal to Trump Democrats and the mythical moderate masses. They are a coalition party and the supporters of The Squad are part of it, no matter how some old heads desperately wish they were not.
Maybe because Pelosi is smart enough to know among her majority there are many players, but few stars. Love 'em or hate 'em, Omar, Tlaib, Pressley and Ocasio-Cortez are stars. Off the top of your head please name four newly-elected Blue Dog Democrats. Don't cheat and Google them. I'll wait.
Which I notice has somehow escaped yours and Opty's attention. Funny thing that.
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Post by robeiae on Jul 18, 2019 12:50:12 GMT -5
That's all good and well, but hardly on point here, except insofar as it pretty much misses the point.
The multi-faceted nature of the Dem party is, I think, exactly what's being tested by the Squad and company. Because they and their legions of social media supporters are establishing purity tests for Dems based on the far left progressive agenda. Once again, clear parallels to the tea party movement, imo.
What's also probably notable about the members of the Squad--with respect to their social media awareness--is that like so much of the twitterverse, they seek to be offended as a matter of course. They search for offense so that they can play the victim.
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Post by robeiae on Jul 18, 2019 13:01:19 GMT -5
You think you're playing me as a hypocrite by referencing a post that invited you personally to try and engage in a mutually beneficial attempt at civility? An attempt you ignored until such time as you believed you could attempt to embarrass me by throwing the quote back in my face to say, "See! I told you he didn't mean any of it!" Stupidly I made a gesture to treat you decently, but obviously you have no clue on how to respond to that sort of thing besides shitting all over it. My bad. Won't happen again. You can bet your sorry and petty ass on that.
As to this, Opty is 100% right. Opty's first response to you in this thread was here: thecollinegate.boards.net/post/30120He's completely civil in his disagreement with you. Your response to him, in contrast, is not. You make it personal, you sling insults, as a matter of course. Like you always do. So...bye. I'm going to give you exactly what you've always wanted: a permanent ban. Because it's just too tedious dealing with someone as dishonest as you. Good luck.
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Post by Optimus on Jul 18, 2019 19:52:28 GMT -5
What's also probably notable about the members of the Squad--with respect to their social media awareness--is that like so much of the twitterverse, they seek to be offended as a matter of course. They search for offense so that they can play the victim. Agreed. But, I think that - yet again - they have played right into Trump's hands. I honestly can't tell if he really is this savvy or if he's just such a huge "bull in a china shop" when it comes to narcissistic stupidity that things go his way a lot just on pure accident. Pelosi and the other Dems seemed like they were starting to do a decent job of ostracizing the DemoBrats and it looked as if it might've turned into a genuine "taking them out to the woodshed" moment for them, taking some of the wind out of their sails (or hot air out of their egos) and I think many of the other Dems on the Hill, and the Dem voters, were behind Pelosi on that. But then Trump wound up killing two birds with one stone by attacking the 4 of them, which caused the Dems to circle the wagons (not sure why they did, given how much "the squad" has attacked their peers, but whatever). When they did that, it sort of painted the picture that, yeah, they really are a part of the Dems and are embraced by them. So, whether it was planned or not, Trump has gotten them to pull those 4 closer rather than pushing them away, and now they are pretty much the public face of the Dems now, much to the consternation of the majority of voter because they are such a toxic group of ballot box poison. Leave it to Trump to be his usual morally bankrupt, racist asshole self and still somehow turn it into a win. He might've just done himself a huge favor for 2020 in terms of tarring and feathering the Dems in terms of public perception. Also, in hanging that public albatross (i.e., The Squad) across the party's neck in such a public way, he totally deflected public and press attention away from the fact that he just enacted a sweeping ban on all asylum seekers coming through the US/Mexico border. If it had been anyone else who had done that, I would've been perturbed at how reprehensible and disgusting his actions were but also recognized the outcome as being a somewhat brilliant political move. But, it's Trump, and he's a moron, so I can't call it that because I honestly think he unintentionally stumbles into these major wins on accident, like a drunk accidentally stumbling into a bar during Happy Hour.
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Post by robeiae on Jul 19, 2019 9:41:37 GMT -5
I'd like to think that Trump is stupid and lucky, but...I don't think that's it. I don't think he's a mastermind, either. Imo, he is what I've always said he is: a grifter. He reads people really well, knows how to push their buttons almost instinctively. And he pushes those buttons to gain an advantage. I wouldn't have thought such a talent would translate to social media, but it appears that it does.
He really is playing a completely different game than everyone else. But it's not like he's playing chess when everyone else is playing checkers; it's more like they're playing checkers and he's playing...marbles?
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Post by michaelw on Jul 19, 2019 19:59:55 GMT -5
Just curious: do you guys think Trump was aware that AOC, Pressley, and Tlaib are not immigrants?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2019 20:10:09 GMT -5
Just curious: do you guys think Trump was aware that AOC, Pressley, and Tlaib are not immigrants? No. Nor do I think it matters to him one way or the other. Nor do I think it matters to those who continue to support him.
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Post by mikey on Jul 19, 2019 21:10:47 GMT -5
Just curious: do you guys think Trump was aware that AOC, Pressley, and Tlaib are not immigrants? I don't think he was focusing on the "immigrant" angle. I think he was making a crack about their heritage.
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Post by Vince524 on Jul 23, 2019 13:11:31 GMT -5
I'd like to think that Trump is stupid and lucky, but...I don't think that's it. I don't think he's a mastermind, either. Imo, he is what I've always said he is: a grifter. He reads people really well, knows how to push their buttons almost instinctively. And he pushes those buttons to gain an advantage. I wouldn't have thought such a talent would translate to social media, but it appears that it does. He really is playing a completely different game than everyone else. But it's not like he's playing chess when everyone else is playing checkers; it's more like they're playing checkers and he's playing...marbles? I'm fairly sure Trump has lost his marbles, but I get the analogy.
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Post by robeiae on Aug 13, 2019 13:16:05 GMT -5
Using Twitter to publicly "clap back" (God, that phrase is stupid) at others is not something that adults do; it's something that 12-year-old brats do. This kind of juvenile shit never helps us, only hurts our chances in 2020 and beyond. I don't think they're just damaging our chances in the next election; they might be damaging the Democrat "brand" for years to come. On the "clap back" front, the term is being used in headlines: Bebe Rexha claps back at 'male music executive' who said she's 'too old to be sexy'And I agree, it's a stupid phrase. But it looks like it's here to stay. As to the above story--that's not political, per se--oh my god, get over yourself, lady.
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Post by Optimus on Aug 13, 2019 14:50:54 GMT -5
Yeah, her story has the slight hint of BS whiffing from it. I mean, sure, it's totally believable that some douchebag would say that to her or any woman. But, while her career behind-the-scenes as a song writer has been successful, her attempt to switch to a headlining act has, despite the initial hype, has failed to materialize. She's only had one song so far that she's sung on (with the group Florida/Georgia Line) that was remotely popular. So, the cynic in me views this as something that has become a bit of a cliche at this point, and that is people manufacturing some controversy that didn't actually happen in order to get attention/PR (or grossly distorting something that did happen in a way that gins up sympathy/attention/PR). Maybe it happened, maybe it didn't. But given that most people have no idea who the hell she is, and her career as a solo artist has thus far floundered or at least disappointed, to me this sounds less like something to legitimately clutch our collective pearls at, and more like something that should be posted on reddit's "that happened" subreddit page. www.reddit.com/r/thatHappened/
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