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Post by Optimus on Mar 18, 2020 23:46:13 GMT -5
Not sure if anyone keeps up on wrestling, but the shows for the past week or so have had no crowds and it's been...a bit weird. Crowd reactions are more important in wrestling, I'd argue, than other sports/entertainment events (except stand-up comedy, obviously), so it's been kind of surreal watching how the companies and performers have handled not having a live audience to interact with. I didn't watch any of WWE's shows this week (saw a few clips, though) but I did catch AEW Dynamite and I appreciated how they approached the weirdness of the situation head on and still, in my opinion, had a pretty good show. Would've been better with a live crowd, of course, but they adapted rather well. It was a shame that Orange Cassidy didn't get a chance to do his usual entertaining "freshly squeezed" shtick, though. Wouldn't have worked without the crowd at all, though, so I can understand why they kept him off to the sides this week. I did see a clip or two of one of the WWE shows and it seems that some wrestlers (e.g., Jeff Hardy) didn't really adjust well in some ways because they were still doing their ring entrances and some of their big moves as if there was a crowd there, which came off kind of weird. AEW Dynamite, on the other hand, was pretty decent all around. Anyone else watch this stuff or care? Just wondering. Figured I'd try to start a conversation that wasn't politically-oriented.  |
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Post by michaelw on Mar 19, 2020 7:02:14 GMT -5
I didn't see the recent shows, although I did hear about this. Definitely makes sense that it wouldn't be the same effect without the crowds there. On the other hand, I can remember about 20 years ago when Mankind and the Rock had an empty arena match. Of course, in that case it was just a gimmick match, not because of any public health issue.
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Post by robeiae on Mar 19, 2020 8:10:27 GMT -5
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Post by prozyan on Mar 19, 2020 13:33:50 GMT -5
Its really a testament to their talent that they can perform that well without an audience. Audience participation and reaction is such a huge part of professional wrestling.
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Post by Optimus on Mar 19, 2020 13:44:38 GMT -5
Le Champion was also hilarious as ringside commentator last night too. I think the other wrestlers at ringside makes sense, and at least gave the sense of a pseudo-crowd being there. Kind of gave it the feel of one of those small town, small crowd wrestling events, which are kind of neat in their own way. |
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Post by robeiae on Mar 28, 2020 18:28:58 GMT -5
On the wrestling/something-to-do-in-quarantine front: watch Dark Side of the Ring episodes on Vice TV and on YouTube. Good stuff. The two part Chris Benoit one is particularly compelling. And Chris Jericho (and Chavo Guerrero, Jr.) comes off looking really good in that one. Jim Ross, not so much.
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Post by Optimus on Mar 28, 2020 18:59:18 GMT -5
Oh yeah. Watched that this past week. Both deeply interesting and deeply disturbing. And Le Champion Chris Jericho proves even more that he's awesome.
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Post by robeiae on May 24, 2020 8:01:39 GMT -5
Watched AEW's pay-per-view last night, Double or Nothing. Off.The. Hook. I was worried that they wouldn't be able to pull it off with no crowds. It's one thing to do a 2-hour TV show, it's something else to do a full pay-per-view in an empty stadium. But damned if they didn't make it all work. And sometimes, things happen--bad things--that somehow provide a positive angle. What am I talking about? Well, yesterday the news broke that 22-year-old Japanese wrestler Hana Kimura (who is also a star of a Netflix series called Terrace House) committed suicide, apparently because of cyber-bullying on social media. AEW acknowledged her passing in the show (and the why behind it) solemnly, without trying to use it as an angle. But the women's title match saw Japanese-born Hikaru Shida claim the belt in a sprawling, violent no-DQ match. No one tried to make it some sort of tribute to Kimura, but the feeling was there, nonetheless. Oh, and the final match of the evening--the "Stadium Stampede," a five-on-five match between the Inner Circle and the Elite--was ridiculously over-the-top. So. Much. Fun. The rest of the card was outstanding, as well, with maybe one exception (the Spears-Rhodes match, a nothing event). |
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Post by Optimus on May 24, 2020 13:13:59 GMT -5
Damn it. I was working on a paper and by the time I stopped, the show was already an hour in. I might still get it today to watch the replay.
AEW has renewed my interest in wrestling after years of avoiding WWE's stale, poorly booked crap.
Also, the season finale of Dark Side of the Ring on the Owen Hart tragedy powerfully emphasizes what a POS Vince McMahon has always been.
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Post by robeiae on May 24, 2020 13:17:11 GMT -5
Also, the season finale of Dark Side of the Ring on the Owen Hart tragedy powerfully emphasizes what a POS Vince McMahon has always been. My son and I watched it the other day. He's not much of a wrestling fan, but he couldn't believe what a shitbag McMahon was in that episode, especially after I explained the Montreal Screw-Job to him. |
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Post by Optimus on May 24, 2020 13:36:20 GMT -5
OK, just started watching it and I thought it was really great to see Eddie Guerrero's wife their in the small crowd. I'm sure that was probably Jericho that got her there, but that's a really sweet gesture to include her.
Also, I'd already heard the rumor that Brian Cage was going to AEW, so it wasn't too surprising when he showed up. But, dang, that dude is a 1000% steroid beast.
And I was laughing out loud when Orange Cassidy was on his back going up the ladder trying to get the chip and again when he tried to choke-slam Luchasaurus. Didn't like that Cage won, though, because it seems a bit cheap to have a dude get a title shot on his first match.
Also had no idea that Jungle Boy (Jack Perry) was Luke Perry's son until JR said it. Thought that was pretty cool.
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Post by robeiae on May 25, 2020 10:06:38 GMT -5
Watched the ppv again last night with my 12 year-old daughter. Her jaw hit the floor at the end.
Also, Sammy Guevara's social media posts are all hilarious:
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Post by Optimus on May 25, 2020 13:25:13 GMT -5
Guevara plays the smarmy, smug-yet-comedic heel beautifully. He's also good in the ring too which helps him sell that image. I think AEW beats the snot out of WWE on three fronts: 1) the focus on more dynamic wrestling ("spots" over "holds"), though NXT does this pretty well too; 2) they don't script their wrestlers' promos, so the talent is allowed to craft their own characters, and; 3) they're not afraid of being goofy in a way that the fans love. Having said that, though, I do think AEW needs to bring in some more "technical" wrestlers to calm down some of the spot-junkies, because a lot of AEW matches can look downright amateurish in how transparently and sloppily they telegraph that they're about to do a big move. WWE takes itself way too seriously and centralizes the creative process to a team of mostly talentless hacks who have lost touch with what the fans actually like. They take this strict control to ridiculous levels, not only in scripting promos but down to outright banning their on-air talent from using a ridiculously long list of words: Not to mention the fact that McMahon's questionable eye for talent is still stuck in the 80s and he is completely out of touch with the modern wrestling audience. AEW lets Jericho be Jericho, for example. Le Champion would never be allowed to do "The Bubbly Bunch" on WWE, or yell "You're a shitty referee!" on a PPV, etc. Orange Cassidy, arguably one of AEW's most popular stars, would never be allowed to have that gimmick on WWE. Matt Hardy's weirdness and the entire bit with Vangard 1 (now NEO 1) would not fly (heh) in the current WWE. This is why I lost interest in WWE about 15 years ago and was bored out of my mind every time I checked in with the product over that time. They push stale, boring losers like Seth Rollins and Roman Reigns even though the fans can't stand them. Hell, even Jon Cena was horrible and when they pushed that dopey fool as their new "face of the company," that was it for me. I was done. They push these schlubs all while doing everything they can to keep stars like Daniel Bryan down until they had to reluctantly accept that he was the most over guy in the company (likely because he was antithetical to everything McMahon erroneously thinks is cool). That's probably the most important difference between the two companies. AEW listens to its fans. They try crazy things, keep what works, and quickly toss out what doesn't (and freely admit to their fans when they've made mistakes. For example, when they dropped the "Nightmare Collective" angle that the fans didn't like: www.wrestlingattitude.com/2020/02/aew-dropped-nightmare-collective-angle.html ). WWE, on the other hand, tries to force the fans to like what they book, rather than booking what the fans like. Even if something or someone isn't over, they'll continue to push them until they take a ratings hit (see: Roman Reigns, Seth Rollins, etc.), then they'll fire the wrestler as if it was that person's fault that WWE creative is complete shit. I'm all in for AEW. Gimme more Le Champion, Orange Cassidy, MJF, etc. I'll likely never go back to WWE unless they drastically change their product. |
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Post by robeiae on May 25, 2020 14:08:18 GMT -5
You're right on AEW looking little amateurish at times. That's partly a consequence of the wrestlers trying too many huge spots, I think. It's gorgeous when it works, though.
My biggest issue with WWE is the way Orton was/is used. I think he should have been the lead-heel of the company for a good decade now. Yet, he's played second fiddle to guys with little more than stupid gimmicks. And maybe part of the problem here is that the faces WWE wanted to put over--like Cena and Reigns--just weren't good enough for Orton. Also, I think the whole separate brands and stables angle--which led to, what, like 15 different championship belts/titles in the WWE--is beyond stupid.
As to the AEW, I think they have a number of future showstoppers--like Guevara, Page, and MJF--and some seriously top notch vets. It's a good combo.
Oh, and at some point Penelope Ford has got to get the credit she deserves, because she's seriously good.
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Post by Optimus on May 25, 2020 15:34:46 GMT -5
Agreed. I think Britt Baker...sorry..."Dr" Britt Baker is also great now that she's playing the heel. Really sucks about her injury though and I hope she's able to heal up well and quickly so she can return. It's also weirdly cool that she's also a dentist as her "day job." Not sure what part of Florida you're in, but she's in Winter Park (Orange county), so maybe you should switch dentists?  |
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