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Post by robeiae on Nov 9, 2017 21:02:20 GMT -5
From that story: Sorry for the derail, but does anyone agree with this? I think the allegations against Spacey stand out waaaaaaaaaaaaay more than the ones against Louis C.K. And imo, he has plenty of equals--and superiors--in comedy.
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Post by Vince524 on Nov 10, 2017 21:48:52 GMT -5
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Post by Don on Nov 11, 2017 16:20:50 GMT -5
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Post by robeiae on Nov 11, 2017 16:42:23 GMT -5
I, for one, am positively sick of George Takei. I remember when it seemed like no one from Star Trek could possibly be more annoying than Shatner. I miss those days...
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2017 16:53:44 GMT -5
But...but...I crush on William Shatner. Takei is sometimes a bit much for me on Twitter. But I always liked his character a lot on Star Trek. (To note, there is nothing about the original Star Trek I don't like. I am a raving geek of a fan.) The allegation against him is terrible. But to be honest, since Takei isn't running for or in elective office, I'm less worked up about it than I am about Moore. Also, anything involving underage kids gets me extra worked up. So while all these other others instances of sexual assault and harassment that are cropping up are terrible, none of them get me on the outrage train quite the way Moore does. I mean, the dude might actually WIN. He's still 50-50 in the polls. Some people are defending him. Some aren't condemning him as vigorously as they should. I've been happy to see a couple of prominent Republicans unequivocally call for him to step down as unfit -- McCain, Kasich, Romney among them. But there's been some hedging and silence among other leaders, and there shouldn't be. Come on, the guy was unfit before these allegations, and the allegations are really well supported. I wouldn't send him to prison without a trial, but saying he's unfit to be a Senator -- yeah, I'm absolutely ready to say that.
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Post by Vince524 on Nov 11, 2017 17:32:20 GMT -5
George has responded on Twitter. Copy and pasted for your convenience.
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Post by Optimus on Nov 12, 2017 1:06:21 GMT -5
As serious of an issue as this is - and I'm glad that the true predators are finally having their careers ruined and that the victims are speaking out - it's getting to be so big that I've wondered lately when we might see some opportunists try to falsely jump on the bandwagon just to say #MeToo in a way that is motivated purely by a desire for attention. I'm not saying that's happened yet, but the Takei and de Grasse Tyson stories do seem very suspicious and bullshit-like to me. I just know that there's a lot of shitty people out there desperate for attention, and things like this seem to draw them out like flies to honey (or vinegar, actually). Just like people lie about having cancer (for the sympathy and money), lie about being racially targeted/attacked (especially when the person wants to get out of trouble), and lie about being homophobically discriminated against (for attention/money and to cast others in a bad light), so I wouldn't doubt that eventually a few people might lie about being sexually assaulted by someone in Hollywood for the attention.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2017 8:00:51 GMT -5
Unfortunately, there are a few people who lie about stuff like this, and may they rot in hell for the doubt they create with regard to real victims and the problems they cause for innocent people they accuse.
I am not ready to toss anyone in jail without a trial, even including Moore. But having them run for Senate or leaving them in a position of trust with regard to vulnerable potential victims -- that's another story. The accused person gets the benefit of the doubt absent a trial when it comes to prison -- but not in those situations.
And when it comes to whether I personally believe the accusations, it depends -- with regard to the story against Takei, I am currently neutral. I know nothing at all about his accuser and can't make any assessment about his credibility. There don't seem to be any other accusers out there yet. I neither believe nor disbelieve him...yet. Nor am I at all inclined to scoff off the victim just because it seems out of character with Takei -- alas, some abusers do come off as swell guys to those they aren't abusing, and alas, often they are in high positions. So, I'm neutral.
Moore is another story -- there are multiple accusers and multiple contemporaneous witnesses to his going after teens and those teens in particular. The stories are well-sourced and entirely credible, and let's face it, Moore wasn't exactly a shining citizen even without the accusations. I believe the victims, period. (Ditto, e.g.., Cosby.)
I don't necessarily need corroboration or proof to believe the victim. But I do need to be able to have enough info about them to assess the story.
Disclosure -- I know several victims of abuse/assault, some of whom kept it bottled up for years. I know why victims keep silent.
But I also knew one false accuser in college. It does happen. Not very often, IMO, in proportion to real victims, but it does happen.
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Post by Amadan on Nov 12, 2017 8:47:10 GMT -5
The difference here is usually the accused comes out with a waffling defense that kinda sorta admits he did something, not just exactly what he's being accused of, or it wasn't that bad, or there is some context, etc.
Takei is saying that the incident did not happen, period. Which means this isn't a case of ambiguity or misunderstanding or indiscretions during more "tolerant" times - one of them is flat-out lying.
I'd have to say that without some corroborating evidence - or even some other guys coming out and making similar accusations - I tend to believe Takei. But I am prepared to be disappointed.
(And I also think Takei is a little insufferable on Twitter, but I'd still be quite disappointed if he really has joined the ranks of sexual predators.)
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Post by robeiae on Nov 14, 2017 8:07:32 GMT -5
Capitol Hill sleaze: www.cnn.com/2017/11/14/politics/sexual-harassment-congress/index.htmlCNN also says this: You know what? I want CNN to name names here. A lot of people--public figures--are getting heat for inappropriate behavior right now. And I don't think all of the stories from their accusers have been verified. Why should congresscritters get an exception? Screw 'em. Let's see some names!
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Post by michaelw on Nov 14, 2017 8:18:28 GMT -5
I'm going to go out on a yuuuuuuuge limb and guess the California one is Rohrabacher. Surely it's either him or Nancy Pelosi.
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Post by Optimus on Nov 14, 2017 8:23:27 GMT -5
They mentioned younger female aides, but wasn't there a brief scandal about male aides being sexually harassed or propositioned several years ago by some Congressmen? I can't recall the details but I think I remember something like that. Anyone else know what I'm talking about? My memory's failing me at the moment.
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Post by robeiae on Nov 14, 2017 8:31:50 GMT -5
Yes, I remember it well. The "page boy" scandal. It was in the early 1980's, when Atari and Pac-Man were all the rage.
I note the latter stuff, because a friend and I re-imagined "Pac-Man" as "Page-Boy." The page boy would move around the halls of Congress picking up paperwork, while being chased by lecherous Congressmen who were trying to rape him. If he was lucky, he'd get to a news reporter (the power-up dots) which would then cause all the bad Congressmen to run away in terror. If the page boy (with Reporter Power) caught him, his career was over.
What? Our friends thought it was funny...
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Post by Amadan on Nov 14, 2017 9:09:26 GMT -5
You know what? I want CNN to name names here. A lot of people--public figures--are getting heat for inappropriate behavior right now. And I don't think all of the stories from their accusers have been verified. Why should congresscritters get an exception? Screw 'em. Let's see some names! The public figures taking heat have admitted to wrongdoing, if not to the particulars of every single accusation, which means they are very unlikely to sue for defamation. Congressmen, if you can't get someone to go on record with the accusation, would be more likely to take legal action, so I expect CNN wants to have its legal bases thoroughly covered.
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Post by robeiae on Nov 14, 2017 9:24:47 GMT -5
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