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Post by celawson on Dec 13, 2017 12:54:06 GMT -5
The other new posts this morning were made while I was typing mine, so I just read them now.
So...not that anyone would believe me, but I left this board temporarily for reasons other than NT's question. When I returned with actual time to participate, I found NT gone. I will be glad to address that question when he returns. Hopefully he will return.
Also, I have no problem admitting to having cognitive dissonance regarding Trump. What some of you don't seem to be able to do is understand that I CAN have it.
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Post by celawson on Dec 13, 2017 12:35:33 GMT -5
Amadan said: . The Palestinian leaders have had an opportunity many times over many years to have their say. We have also said a zillion times that we are committed to negotiating a peace process. We've thrown them bone after bone. Has it made a difference? I think the answer to that is obvious. Our foreign policy should be doing the right thing for the right reasons, not avoiding doing the right thing because we're afraid the terrorists are going to get violent. That's the whole point of terrorism, right? Getting their way because people are afraid? Giving them the desired response here just encourages more of the same. Anyway, Trump did say this in his speech: His speech was plenty diplomatic. Amadan said: So now I hate all Arabs, and I was lying when I said I want to give the middle finger to only terrorists and those who want to wipe Israel off the map. Got it. Thanks. Amadan said: Note, I used his family members as an example that Trump has likely discussed and thought about this issue. I didn't use the word "wisdom", I said "thought". You said he did this without thought. You really should read my posts more carefully. However, Jared Kushner, for reasons I already stated above, is not just your average Joe family member on this issue. This was one of Trump's campaign promises. Of COURSE he's thought about it, And he's met with experts and advisors on this issue. You're concerned about what's best for America. How is siding with corrupt terrorists, or being kowtowed by the same, "best for America"? MichaelW said: This is just one excellent example of "bones" that have been tossed to the Palestinian leadership. See where it got us. Cassandra said: Past presidents haven't necessarily been right in this instance. Or, after bashing one's head against the wall for years, perhaps it's the right time for a new approach. God forbid we make the liwwle tewwowists mad. What about Senate Resolution 176? This bill was passed by the U.S. Senate several months ago by a vote of NINETY to ZERO. Let me repeat that - 90-0. It was co-authored by Schumer. And on page 2, it says (bolding mine): www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/senate-resolution/176/text?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%5B%22senate+resolution+jerusalem+50%22%5D%7D&r=2Where was all the hysteria about rocking the boat when this was passed unanimously? Did no one want to take out that particular "Whereas" phrase? Was this deemed a terrible thing back in May? Why is the sky falling now? Which brings me to the last points I want to make. Just because I defend Trump on this board does NOT mean I am all in for Trump. There are plenty of things I dislike about Trump the man and Trump the POTUS. However, unlike many, I'm willing and able to give him credit when he deserves it. And he deserves it here. I'm willing to defend him when he's unfairly attacked. I take things issue by issue. I thought it was unfair to say he did this without thought or consideration of the issue, so I stepped in. Plus it makes for more lively debate. People here seem to think that means I support everything he does and everything he says. That's extremely incorrect. Yet my occasional defenses here of some of Trump's actions as POTUS seem to have made people very angry with me. For example: Cassandra said: Beyond the fact that how this was worded makes it clear that my occasional defense of Trump here enrages her to the point where she's imagining a form of torture for me, she's also assuming that because I defended Trump's decision on Israel, I agree with ALL of his Tweets and would defend them. How does an Ivy League educated lawyer (as we've been reminded) make that leap? It's not an intelligence issue, obviously (see Ivy League reference). I have to assume it's due to a loss of objectivity in raging hatred of Trump. Like CNN and MSNBC and practically all Democrats right now, and possibly Mueller's team. And Amadan's assumption that I want to give the middle finger to ALL Arabs, even though I just stated exactly which ones I would give it to, is another example of the bias that overtakes people due to their hatred of Trump. I occasionally defend Trump's policy decisions on this board, and I'm suddenly a hater of all Arabs. I'm also willing to criticize him when he deserves it. I hate many of his Tweets. Yesterday's was particularly awful. They are infantile and he should stop yesterday. I wish he would comport himself better as POTUS. He does things that embarrass me, too. I've said these things before. Here. I simply don't have to do that very often because most everyone else is, constantly, including the "mainstream media". It's in my face every day. But Trump's administration IS doing things I agree with that Hillary's would not be doing, and I'm thankful for that. So let me make this clear -- I am NOT a blind Trump supporter. I am trying to be objective about his actions as POTUS, and when they are good I will commend him. When they are bad, I won't. But when they are bad, I will consider the use of my time if I were to join in the piling on. Also, thank you to Christine and the two Mikes on this board -- you're all very appreciated.
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Post by celawson on Dec 11, 2017 20:28:19 GMT -5
I say good for Trump. Unlike those who hate the man so much they can only see bad in whatever he does, (or if the action isn't inherently bad then his motivation for it must be) I do think he is sincerely attempting to do the right thing by Israel. He promised that from day one in his campaign, and he's following through. And it WAS the right thing to do, not only for Israel our friend and ally, but for the peace process itself. It's time the Palestinians begin to learn that the world (or at least the U.S.) won't kowtow to them on this any longer. They have to meet in the middle somewhere, in order for this peace process to work, if it ever will work. All the gnashing of teeth reminds me of the dramatic despair over Brexit...or of how the stock market would crash if Trump got elected... This isn't exactly "meeting in the middle." It's telling the Palestinians "Fuck you." Maybe that's what you actually think Trump should be doing (I don't have a problem per se with telling the Palestinians to go pound sand, myself), but do not pretend this was some thoughtful and considered move towards a more stable peace. This was Trump showboating, ingratiating himself with Israel, and giving the Palestinians and their Arab supporters the middle finger. And you and everyone else pretending you luurrrrve Trump and will continue to pretend you were never asked your thoughts about being a pussy to grab by the POTUS are just pounding the table and hooting because you like the idea of giving Arabs the middle finger. I don't disapprove of what Trump did in itself. I disapprove of the fact that he did it without thought, introspection, or a plan. He just does whatever makes his dick hard at any given moment. I do admit I like the idea of giving some Arabs the middle finger -- those who are terrorists and those who want to wipe Israel off the face of the earth among them. To your other point, I find it really fascinating that some people on this board can know exactly how much thought or introspection another person puts into an action or decision or even a post on this board. Some gifted ones also know how much Googling another has done, or how many links they have read. It's truly amazing. Anyway, back to Trump... You are so sure Trump did this without thought, introspection, or a plan that you call this a "fact". Ok. I happen to think you don't know at all how much thought Trump put into this. He has advisors and has been discussing a plan for Middle East peace for some time now. For goodness' sake, his son-in-law is Jewish, religious, educated at Jewish schools, has visited Israel many times since he was a child, is a big Israel supporter whose family is even close with Netanyahu. And Trump's daughter converted to Judaism. It makes logical sense to assume Trump actually has discussed the Israel situation with at least Jared and Ivanka on multiple occasions prior to him being POTUS, and with them and other experts after the election. It defies logic that Trump went into this without thought or introspection or a plan, and plenty of people who heard his speech on the matter think it was well-reasoned and appropriately delicate, given the strong feelings on both sides.
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Post by celawson on Dec 11, 2017 14:00:43 GMT -5
I say good for Trump. Unlike those who hate the man so much they can only see bad in whatever he does, (or if the action isn't inherently bad then his motivation for it must be) I do think he is sincerely attempting to do the right thing by Israel. He promised that from day one in his campaign, and he's following through. And it WAS the right thing to do, not only for Israel our friend and ally, but for the peace process itself. It's time the Palestinians begin to learn that the world (or at least the U.S.) won't kowtow to them on this any longer. They have to meet in the middle somewhere, in order for this peace process to work, if it ever will work.
All the gnashing of teeth reminds me of the dramatic despair over Brexit...or of how the stock market would crash if Trump got elected...
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Post by celawson on Dec 10, 2017 15:24:01 GMT -5
Soooo many instructions while the guy was intoxicated and scared. For Pete's sake, he was ordered to hold his hands up, then to CRAWL. I do think the chances for a bad outcome were maximized, when of course they should have been minimized. So yeah, in that last moment when Shaver reached back, I can see how a cop would have been concerned. But all of those steps leading up to it...no surprise at all that the poor guy did something "wrong". So tragic.
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Post by celawson on Dec 8, 2017 11:38:13 GMT -5
Hmmm. I'm a woman who happens to love the differences between the sexes, and I am definitely attracted to many of the traits we attribute to "real men". And physical toughness and athleticism are both included in that list. And yeah, there's something very tough about a football player that is not the same, say, for a baseball player (except maybe a catcher), or a dancer. So to that extent, I agree with Mitchell. However, that doesn't mean other less physical or even gentle traits are not also on that list of being a real man. And it doesn't mean that other less desirable or even objectionable traits must go hand in hand with that "manly" physical toughness. (like treating women poorly). As a matter of fact, I think a very nice trait of being a "real man" is treating women with respect and even protectiveness, as long as it doesn't venture into being controlling. I think a venn diagram would be helpful here. Too bad I can't draw one on the forum.
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Post by celawson on Nov 14, 2017 11:39:04 GMT -5
This is a long thread, and i haven't been around much, so I'm responding to some stuff around page 9. As a Catholic, I think offering one's thoughts and prayers is not only appropriate, but absolutely the right thing to do for people of faith in this case where the victims were actively religious people. The idea that the purpose of prayer is to ask for things, and that prayer doesn't work if those things aren't received, is a very immature, simplistic, and incorrect view of what prayer is or can be (meaning the best expression of prayer). That's why people like Wheaton or Obermann don't have a clue that there is no irony in the fact that the victims were gunned down while praying in a church. Life happens. Shitty things happen. Unfair things happen. And unfortunately, evil happens. And no one, no matter how faith-filled or holy, is immune to bad things happening to them. We're all going to die. We're all going to have pain. That's life. But prayer can give fellowship and comfort and grace. The power of prayer to heal, by the words and actions of those who care enough to pray for someone and with someone, is real. Not for everyone. But certainly for many. And isn't that what's important here in the immediate aftermath of this tragedy? To help this shattered community of faith heal? Note, I said "immediate aftermath". When everyone is reeling in shock and pain. I agree that for a politician such as Ryan, as Christine astutely said around page 9 of this thread, prayer is NOT sufficient. But it's something, and it shouldn't be derided by atheists who cannot fathom the goodness prayer can accomplish just by the action of solidarity and expression of caring and love. And if I were going to be gunned down, I'd much prefer it be in God's house where I am praying with my church family, than alone in a random supermarket, or dance club, or on a street in Las Vegas.
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Post by celawson on Nov 12, 2017 14:29:28 GMT -5
I bought an HP Spectre touch screen laptop a year ago or so, and I love it. Yours looks a lot like mine, actually. I hadn't even heard of yours until right now, since I haven't been in the market. I'm curious about your keyboard, though. My keyboard is the least favorite part of the Spectre for me. Glad you're loving your new investment!
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Post by celawson on Sept 11, 2017 20:01:05 GMT -5
Yay, poet! Now we just need to hear from Robo, and to hear if Don's house made it ok.
Thanks for the info on insulin, Don! Sorry I missed that earlier! I texted it to my friend - she's a worrying mom.
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Post by celawson on Sept 8, 2017 12:05:42 GMT -5
I second what Cass said!
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Post by celawson on Sept 8, 2017 10:37:30 GMT -5
What's your plan, Rob?
I can't believe what you all are going through. I'm so sorry. The weather over here (southern California) is always so bland, but I suppose having the great quake will be no picnic. And we'd have no warning, either.
I have a friend whose daughter lives in Florida. Both she and her fiance have insulin dependent diabetes, and the worry (one of the worries) is how to keep their insulin refrigerated if they lose power.
Please be safe!
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Post by celawson on Aug 28, 2017 21:39:01 GMT -5
You've made some good points and asked me some tough questions, NT. I'm going to make dinner and think hard on this, and I'll come back and give you some honest answers.
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Post by celawson on Aug 28, 2017 12:49:54 GMT -5
Thank you to Opty for linking and quoting from and discussing the same study I linked to earlier when Amadan asked for proof discimination of conservatives in academia. I neglected to quote from it. (I may have been worried about worsening my reputation for cutting and pasting, who knows?) Apparently no one arguing with me clicked on the link. In the same vein, the other link I provided has an excellent and research-based discussion about how, once the numbers with regards to ideology are not balanced, the imbalance is reinforced due to phenomena like group think etc. I will link this again, in case anyone missed it. www.independent.org/publications/tir/article.asp?a=731This seems to be borne out by the consistent increasing imbalance in certain academic departments over the last decade or two. I'm still trying to find the article with the graphs illustrating this increase which I mentioned earlier. As far as conservatives not going into some sorts of liberal arts areas due to their own preferences, I don't disagree with that. And I wouldn't be concerned with that if the left side of academia was as open to presenting and discussing and respecting valid opposing viewpoints as conservatives are. But it seems in very many instances they are not. Especially in our more elite universities like Ivy League. And I gave an example of the philosophy at Hillsdale College, a conservative liberal arts college that greatly values free speech and emphasizes college as a place to immerse oneself in opposing views, so as to best critically examine and better develop one's own views. That is what a university should be, as I said above.
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Post by celawson on Aug 28, 2017 12:07:29 GMT -5
I am so glad my daughter isn't at Berkeley. But we have close friends whose daughter is beginning freshman year there. I hope she stays far away from any of these protests. So.......many people, including myself, said Trump should have more strongly denounced the Nazis immediately, otherwise he can take partial blame for any emboldened behavior the white supremacists begin to demonstrate. And I still agree with that sentiment. However, in the same way, these Antifa thugs have been given a lot of leeway for too long simply because they "say" they're against hate and fascism. And I think they're emboldened. They largely received a pass at Charlottesville, even though it appeared in plenty of video clips (and in the long well-done news report by Vice News linked by nighttimer recently) that Antifa were instigating violence. They clearly use violence. They beat people up at will. They pepper spray people. They throw urine on cops. They destroy property. They use fascist tactics. It's terrible. And why do they wear masks? Their chant at Berkeley yesterday was "No Trump. No Wall. No U.S.A at all!" Um.... So I do hope that they receive the backlash they are due, and I hope people of higher moral standards and better impulse control help bring our society back to a place where we can more calmly discuss political differences, and squelch hate, in a more peaceful way.
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Post by celawson on Aug 26, 2017 11:05:55 GMT -5
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