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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2017 17:09:23 GMT -5
Nobody should be able to issue so many far sweeping executive orders as he's done in 1 week and call himself a conservative. He's not. Not that I ever thought he was. Agree, Vince. It's taken my breath away. I don't think Trump is a conservative. If he were a genuine conservative, I wouldn't have nearly the issues I have with him. Heck, if he tended conservative on the economic side and libertarian/liberal on social issues, I might actually like him. To me, Trump is the worst of all worlds. I didn't expect to like him. But he's actually surprised me this first week by being worse than I expected. On top of it, I think so far he's proving every bit the loose cannon I feared.
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Post by robeiae on Jan 30, 2017 17:10:57 GMT -5
Wrong. He'd have the approval of 3 million more people than he has now. Lol, no he wouldn't. Most would still despise him completely. They're going to no matter what he does or doesn't do.
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Post by Rolling Thunder on Jan 30, 2017 17:15:12 GMT -5
Wrong. He'd have the approval of 3 million more people than he has now. If they were Chihuahuas I'd be elated.
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Post by robeiae on Jan 30, 2017 17:19:16 GMT -5
Well, no one is going to get elected with a promise to kill puppies. Regardless, I submit that the only way that Trump could possibly be doing an excellent job--for people with your mindset, Cass--is if he was purposefully not doing any of the things he said he would, if he was in fact reversing himself completely on multiple fronts. Yet if he was doing that, he'd be roundly condemned as a matter of course. Right? Yes, that is the only way he'd be doing an excellent job. That's not because he's conservative so much as because he made so many promises I thought were batshit, crappy ideas. If he were simply moving towards implementing more conservative economic policies, selecting qualified conservatives for his cabinet, and quietly forgetting about shit like his Muslim ban and Mexican wall, weren't executing so many ill-thought-out executive orders and stranding legal residents of the U.S. all over the world, he could earn a satisfactory (better than expected) and/or a "I'll wait and see." If Jeb or Kasich were president now, I've no doubt that's how it would be going, and I wouldn't be so fucking disgusted right now. I might not be thrilled, either, but there's a fair shot I might like at least some of what they were doing, and at any rate, I don't think they'd be implementing it so rashly and with so little thought. I'm also pretty certain they'd have carefully vetted, qualified cabinet appointees, whom I might not love, but wouldn't be able to scoff at. Instead, Trump is ramming down the parts of his pre-election ranting I found least palatable, making dubious (at best) appointments, and creating chaos. I'm moderate on the economic side. I've got a distinct libertarian streak on many issues. A moderate conservative would not freak me out. Trump does. The point is, rating Trump's job performance is pointless, if one starts from the position that Trump's platform was 99% wrong (or some such number). We--meaning pretty much everyone--routinely bitch about politicians who don't follow through on their platforms and promises. Obama has caught all kinds of shit for that. And Trump even now is catching shit for pivoting on how the wall will be paid for, right? If one is going to make NOT fulfilling these things a necessary component of doing a good job, one really isn't "rating" anything. It's just another angle to proclaim Trump is awful. Which is of course fine. But let's not pretend there's any sort of honest assessment going on here.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2017 17:19:56 GMT -5
People like puppies.
I admit that the puppy-killing bit was a bit of hyperbole. My point, though, was that whether keeping promises is a good thing sometimes depends on what the promise is. I can give a grudging point to someone for keeping a promise I didn't love, at least to the "well, he kept his promise" point. But I'm not going to give him a cookie for keeping promises I thought were batshit, offensive, or just really bad ideas.
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Post by Rolling Thunder on Jan 30, 2017 17:25:39 GMT -5
Nobody should be able to issue so many far sweeping executive orders as he's done in 1 week and call himself a conservative. He's not. Not that I ever thought he was. Agree, Vince. It's taken my breath away. I don't think Trump is a conservative. If he were a genuine conservative, I wouldn't have nearly the issues I have with him. Heck, if he tended conservative on the economic side and libertarian/liberal on social issues, I might actually like him. To me, Trump is the worst of all worlds. I didn't expect to like him. But he's actually surprised me this first week by being worse than I expected. On top of it, I think so far he's proving every bit the loose cannon I feared. Of course he's not true conservative He's a populist reform party member masquerading as a Republican. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reform_Party_of_the_United_States_of_America
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2017 17:26:40 GMT -5
Wrong. He'd have the approval of 3 million more people than he has now. If they were Chihuahuas I'd be elated. oh, Haggis isn't going to like that. Yes, that is the only way he'd be doing an excellent job. That's not because he's conservative so much as because he made so many promises I thought were batshit, crappy ideas. If he were simply moving towards implementing more conservative economic policies, selecting qualified conservatives for his cabinet, and quietly forgetting about shit like his Muslim ban and Mexican wall, weren't executing so many ill-thought-out executive orders and stranding legal residents of the U.S. all over the world, he could earn a satisfactory (better than expected) and/or a "I'll wait and see." If Jeb or Kasich were president now, I've no doubt that's how it would be going, and I wouldn't be so fucking disgusted right now. I might not be thrilled, either, but there's a fair shot I might like at least some of what they were doing, and at any rate, I don't think they'd be implementing it so rashly and with so little thought. I'm also pretty certain they'd have carefully vetted, qualified cabinet appointees, whom I might not love, but wouldn't be able to scoff at. Instead, Trump is ramming down the parts of his pre-election ranting I found least palatable, making dubious (at best) appointments, and creating chaos. I'm moderate on the economic side. I've got a distinct libertarian streak on many issues. A moderate conservative would not freak me out. Trump does. The point is, rating Trump's job performance is pointless, if one starts from the position that Trump's platform was 99% wrong (or some such number). We--meaning pretty much everyone--routinely bitch about politicians who don't follow through on their platforms and promises. Obama has caught all kinds of shit for that. And Trump even now is catching shit for pivoting on how the wall will be paid for, right? If one is going to make NOT fulfilling these things a necessary component of doing a good job, one really isn't "rating" anything. It's just another angle to proclaim Trump is awful. Which is of course fine. But let's not pretend there's any sort of honest assessment going on here. oh, please. honest assessment my ass. Even taking aside that I don't like his policies, there's reason to give him a rotten grade for his first week. The guy has caused fucking chaos with his ill-considered, overly sweeping Muslim ban. Come on, sweeping in people with valid visas and fucking green cards, and implementing it so abruptly he stranded them all over the world? That's a disaster -- and a good many conservatives (and a federal judge) agree. Yeah, I don't like the policy itself. But even if I did, I'd think his implementation of it was a disaster. And it's what happens when you crank out a whole bunch of drastic executive actions your first week in office. Ditto on the way he's gone about his cabinet appointees. Even aside from the not liking them or thinking them qualified (Carson for HUD?!), he is way the hell behind on selecting and vetting them. We've got holes everywhere, and I think that's bad news. Of course we all bring our political biases to our opinions -- I do, you do, we all do. But can you remember there EVER being this much chaos in the first week of any president's tenure? I sure as hell can't.
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Post by Christine on Jan 30, 2017 18:38:39 GMT -5
Wrong. He'd have the approval of 3 million more people than he has now. Lol, no he wouldn't. Most would still despise him completely. They're going to no matter what he does or doesn't do. "Most," eh? I think you mean most... people who rage on the interwebz. I for one would heartily approve of him changing course, especially on the issues Cass has heretofore stated.
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Post by robeiae on Jan 30, 2017 18:55:46 GMT -5
If they were Chihuahuas I'd be elated. oh, Haggis isn't going to like that. The point is, rating Trump's job performance is pointless, if one starts from the position that Trump's platform was 99% wrong (or some such number). We--meaning pretty much everyone--routinely bitch about politicians who don't follow through on their platforms and promises. Obama has caught all kinds of shit for that. And Trump even now is catching shit for pivoting on how the wall will be paid for, right? If one is going to make NOT fulfilling these things a necessary component of doing a good job, one really isn't "rating" anything. It's just another angle to proclaim Trump is awful. Which is of course fine. But let's not pretend there's any sort of honest assessment going on here. oh, please. honest assessment my ass. Even taking aside that I don't like his policies, there's reason to give him a rotten grade for his first week. The guy has caused fucking chaos with his ill-considered, overly sweeping Muslim ban. Come on, sweeping in people with valid visas and fucking green cards, and implementing it so abruptly he stranded them all over the world? That's a disaster -- and a good many conservatives (and a federal judge) agree. Yeah, I don't like the policy itself. But even if I did, I'd think his implementation of it was a disaster. And it's what happens when you crank out a whole bunch of drastic executive actions your first week in office. Ditto on the way he's gone about his cabinet appointees. Even aside from the not liking them or thinking them qualified (Carson for HUD?!), he is way the hell behind on selecting and vetting them. We've got holes everywhere, and I think that's bad news. Of course we all bring our political biases to our opinions -- I do, you do, we all do. But can you remember there EVER being this much chaos in the first week of any president's tenure? I sure as hell can't. 1) Per RT, I think grading him on week one is just too soon. Doesn't mean one can't find lots of faults with what he has done, of course. 2) There's been--imnsho--a lot of shit burgers appointed by previous Presidents, people who I thought were obvious shit burgers from day one. Ray LaHood LEAPS to mind. Right now, I think Trump is under the mother of all microscopes, with regard to every action he takes, every appointment he makes (which he earned 100% imo, because of his dickish attitude). 3) As to executive orders, I don't like they're being cranked out, either. But that table was partially set by the previous President. Chickens, roosts, and all that. All that said, I don't like the way things are going with Trump right now (mostly). But there's a shit ton of people who do. Some of that chaos--which involves ending the "this is the way things have always been done" mantra--is exactly why they voted for Trump, exactly why he won imo.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2017 20:18:57 GMT -5
This pretty much sums up how I feel these days:
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Post by Christine on Jan 30, 2017 20:45:47 GMT -5
All that said, I don't like the way things are going with Trump right now (mostly). But there's a shit ton of people who do. Some of that chaos--which involves ending the "this is the way things have always been done" mantra--is exactly why they voted for Trump, exactly why he won imo. Wait, so you're saying Trump is issuing executive orders because Obama did, and that's chickens coming to roost, and yet people were sick of the way things were being done, and Trump's way is somehow novel? Also, please explain "mostly." What things has Trump done so far that you like?
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Post by Christine on Jan 30, 2017 20:53:09 GMT -5
Of course he's not true conservative He's a populist reform party member masquerading as a Republican. What are you smoking? And you should share, yanno.
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Post by Rolling Thunder on Jan 30, 2017 21:56:31 GMT -5
Of course he's not true conservative He's a populist reform party member masquerading as a Republican. What are you smoking? And you should share, yanno. Mexican, of course. And I'm starting a new business -- Donald Trump pinatas. I'll make a fortune.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 30, 2017 21:58:42 GMT -5
I'd buy one.
ETA:
How about a gift set with a bottle of tequila?
It would be nice to work the wall in there somewhere...
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Post by Christine on Jan 30, 2017 22:22:43 GMT -5
Perhaps a lego kit, with instructions for constructing a miniature wall, plus evil brown figurines to put on the outside.*
*Trump pinata sold separately.
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