|
Post by poetinahat on Mar 9, 2017 17:55:58 GMT -5
I don't think that "like and share" would have the same effect. Women try to raise awareness for issues they care about on social media: They're slacktivists who never do anything productive. My comment had nothing to do with women. It was about the suggestion that demonstrations shouldn't inconvenience anyone.
|
|
|
Post by celawson on Mar 9, 2017 18:01:56 GMT -5
I'm a woman, and I agree with both Don and Vince. This was a dumb idea. Poorly thought out. Poorly executed. Silly. Unfocused. Difficult to define. Whiny. With a definite Marxist flavor. And it's particularly easy to criticize because it's in a country with some of the greatest freedoms and opportunities for women in the entire world. As a doctor, I didn't have the choice to strike and leave my patients unattended. But I would not have done this anyway. I graduated from a top 20 med school where there were more women than men in my graduating class. And when I bill for my services, my pay is exactly what a male would get doing the same thing. And yes, I do a lot of work at home, for my kids and husband, to keep the household a comfortable place and calm center for our family. I get fulfillment out of doing that, and I'm not ashamed of it. I don't need "society" to pat me on the back for it, and I certainly don't want society to take over these responsibilities for me. I think it's interesting that this "strike" is calling for unity between the work done in the formal economy and that done in the domestic sphere, (paraphrased from the New York Times article on this www.nytimes.com/2017/03/08/opinion/why-women-are-on-strike.html ), whatever that actually means, but really, the feminist movement needs to take some responsibility for devaluing the wonderful work that stay at home moms and wives do. I guess the main point of my post is that all women cannot be crammed into the same box in terms of perspective on this, just because of their gender. Some people are just not happy unless they are unhappy.
|
|
|
Post by nighttimer on Mar 9, 2017 18:34:33 GMT -5
I'm a woman, and I agree with both Don and Vince. This was a dumb idea. Poorly thought out. Poorly executed. Silly. Unfocused. Difficult to define. Whiny. With a definite Marxist flavor. And it's particularly easy to criticize because it's in a country with some of the greatest freedoms and opportunities for women in the entire world. As a doctor, I didn't have the choice to strike and leave my patients unattended. But I would not have done this anyway. I graduated from a top 20 med school where there were more women than men in my graduating class. And when I bill for my services, my pay is exactly what a male would get doing the same thing. And yes, I do a lot of work at home, for my kids and husband, to keep the household a comfortable place and calm center for our family. I get fulfillment out of doing that, and I'm not ashamed of it. I don't need "society" to pat me on the back for it, and I certainly don't want society to take over these responsibilities for me. I think it's interesting that this "strike" is calling for unity between the work done in the formal economy and that done in the domestic sphere, (paraphrased from the New York Times article on this www.nytimes.com/2017/03/08/opinion/why-women-are-on-strike.html ), whatever that actually means, but really, the feminist movement needs to take some responsibility for devaluing the wonderful work that stay at home moms and wives do. I guess the main point of my post is that all women cannot be crammed into the same box in terms of perspective on this, just because of their gender. Some people are just not happy unless they are unhappy. So you're happy making $20,000 less than a male doctor because you don't have a penis? Good to know you're happy and not whiny at all about that pay inequity thing. You'd probably only waste that extra $20K on frilly things and getting your nails done. Next time you're hanging out with your doctor bros make sure they pick up the bar tab for your fuzzy navels.
|
|
|
Post by Christine on Mar 9, 2017 18:41:38 GMT -5
Women try to raise awareness for issues they care about on social media: They're slacktivists who never do anything productive. My comment had nothing to do with women. It was about the suggestion that demonstrations shouldn't inconvenience anyone. I took Angie's post not as criticizing yours, but as riffing off it to make another point: seems like women are damned no matter what avenue they attempt to take in order to point out sexism and discrimination. They're not speaking, they're whining and not doing anything productive; or, they're not protesting or boycotting properly, they're doing it wrong, they're ineffective, their symbols of solidarity are dumb. And WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN. Etc.
|
|
|
Post by Christine on Mar 9, 2017 19:18:16 GMT -5
And when I bill for my services, my pay is exactly what a male would get doing the same thing. Having your own practice and billing insurance companies (?) is not the same as being employed and getting a paycheck, as I'm sure you know. I bill clients at standard rates in my profession, too. I have my own practice; I call the shots. I don't know that I'd automatically get the same pay as a male counterpart in a large firm.
|
|
|
Post by poetinahat on Mar 9, 2017 20:55:25 GMT -5
I'm reminded of a time last year when the Australian Treasurer, Joe Hockey, was addressing the issue of housing prices (and rents) shooting out of reach for new buyers/renters. His response: "They should get better jobs."
|
|
|
Post by Christine on Mar 9, 2017 21:30:11 GMT -5
Let them eat cake.
ETA: and stop all that whining! I'm a woman and I have cake, which obviously means all women have access to cake. If you don't have cake, it's most certainly your fault. Also, did I mention, stop whining. You're interrupting my cake.
|
|
|
Post by Optimus on Mar 9, 2017 22:06:16 GMT -5
Every time I see the title of this thread pop up, this gets stuck in my head:
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 9, 2017 22:28:56 GMT -5
They just don't make hair bands like they used to.
|
|
|
Post by Angie on Mar 9, 2017 22:56:33 GMT -5
My comment had nothing to do with women. It was about the suggestion that demonstrations shouldn't inconvenience anyone. I took Angie's post not as criticizing yours, but as riffing off it to make another point: seems like women are damned no matter what avenue they attempt to take in order to point out sexism and discrimination. They're not speaking, they're whining and not doing anything productive; or, they're not protesting or boycotting properly, they're doing it wrong, they're ineffective, their symbols of solidarity are dumb. And WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN. Etc. Yes, that's exactly what I meant. Sorry I wasn't clearer about it, Poet. Was definitely not jumping on your post.
|
|
|
Post by Don on Mar 10, 2017 6:40:00 GMT -5
Let them eat cake. ETA: and stop all that whining! I'm a woman and I have cake, which obviously means all women have access to cake. If you don't have cake, it's most certainly your fault. Also, did I mention, stop whining. You're interrupting my cake. Cake? Are you trying to distract Vince? And what's "cake" stand for in your metaphor? Because I can state it clearly in my interpretation. Only a minor revision is required to mirror exactly what I've been pointing out about this strike; the elitist attitude of the organizers and their call for women to eat cake, even those with no bread. "I'm a woman and I have cake the wherewithal to strike for a day, which obviously means all women have access to cake the wherewithal to strike for a day. If you don't have cake the wherewithal to strike for a day, it's most certainly your fault. Also, did I mention, stop whining. You're interrupting my cake strike."
|
|
|
Post by Christine on Mar 10, 2017 7:07:43 GMT -5
Point the women out to me who criticized other women for not taking the day off due to critical responsibilities or financial need, and I'll call them assholes.
I found out about this strike after the fact, but what I read promoted the idea by saying, if you can take the day off, do it. If you can't, wear red. Don't shop if you can avoid it. Wear red. Tell people why you're wearing red. I also read, in response to people worrying about people in hospitals and whatnot, that yeah, no, people in the medical field generally don't let their patients die, that's not a thing.
I think your metaphor for cake lacks a realistic object for comparison.
My cake stands for all the people who think everything is great because it's great for them. There is a disconnect there.
|
|
|
Post by Vince524 on Mar 10, 2017 8:27:35 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by robeiae on Mar 10, 2017 9:13:06 GMT -5
As far as I'm concerned, people get to choose for themselves if they want to participate in these sorts of things. If there are consequences in that regard, there are consequences. Honestly though, the event had no impact on me, whatsoever. If women around here went on strike, I didn't notice. If they wore red in protest, I didn't notice. I didn't see much in the way of news coverage around here, either. But I did see that one of the participants in the event is a convicted Palestinian terrorist. That fact is being spun, however, with many sites calling her one of the organizers, but the piece I linked to does a good job of showing that this is unfounded. Still, it fairly notes that there has been no denunciations in this regard. And indeed, there is a deep-seated link here: ijr.com/2017/03/820121-a-day-without-a-woman-strike-has-alarming-anti-israel-partnerships-and-a-convicted-terrorist-as-a-leader/
|
|
|
Post by celawson on Mar 10, 2017 11:11:25 GMT -5
Ohio, I'm VERY skeptical of claims of gender wage gap, because I think many of those studies don't account for certain very important variables. For example, your study above that found wage gap between black and white docs did not take into consideration medical specialty. www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/06/08/the-racial-pay-gap-extends-even-to-doctors/?utm_term=.090534849c9cNow, let's take that same concern and look at women. I've posted an excerpt from an American Medical Association Wire article - Lo and behold, women also do not go into the highest paying specialties as much as men do: wire.ama-assn.org/education/how-medical-specialties-vary-genderFamily medicine and pediatrics are the two lowest paying medical specialties, and women do gravitate more to primary care. Anesthesiology and various surgical specialties are among the highest paid. Women do not gravitate to those in large numbers. Surgical residencies are hellish ways to live, for years at a time, during some of the prime child-bearing years for a woman. And many surgical careers, with all night surgeries and emergency call, are not conducive to a good family life. It is not surprising that many women would avoid those specialties. Plenty of my friends had this sort of conversation with me during those years. My opinion, supported by data, is that lifestyle choice accounts for the vast majority of wage gap issues, and I would accept that is true not only in medicine but in other careers as well. To be frank, if an institution was proven to have serious wage gap issues that were strictly gender or race discrimination, I would be glad to picket them. But there are legal ways to address those issues, are there not? This blanket "strike", which I can't even figure out what the reasons stated really mean, was an exercise in Marxist group think by a faction of the left which likes to be angry and doesn't appear to like very deep examination of the truth.
|
|